Wednesday, October 22, 2014

Musings: On My Critics, Round 2

Yesterday's post, where I asked why good people in the anti-GMO movement hadn't stood up against the jackboot behavior of their cohorts, prompted this comment from Ed Coll:

You say you have no soft soft spot for the chem/seed companies yet the bulk of your criticism is aimed at the anti-movement. Where is the balance? You decry “the promulgation of misinformation” by the anti-movement and do a great job pointing such misinformation out but fail to point out the misinformation of the chem/seed companies. Likewise you analyze funding sources and amounts the anti-movement spends but not the spending and lobbying of the chem/seed companies. No mention of the historical relationship between HICA and UH-CTAHR, the projects and research members of HICA fund at CTAHR or how such funding might influence what is researched, or how much HICA pays Becker Communications to churn out propaganda, or how much Jon Entine and Karl Haro von Mogel were paid and by whom. You also stress “voluntary disclosure” as if the fox guarding the hen house has ever been good for the chickens. No mention of how the FDA has been a captive agency since 1977 and has failed to regulate the use of antibiotics on feed animals perhaps resulting in antibiotic resistance in humans.

While it is valid to criticize the uncivil, stumbling, bumbling mis-steps of local "activists" and their "leaders" how about looking into the misdeeds of corporate and government actors as well. You seem to be always aiming at David and giving Goliath a free pass.

I want to respond to that comment in a post, because it's a criticism that others with ideological blinders and short memories have levied, too. And it's pure bullshit.

For nearly a decade I wrote frequently about the seed/chem companies in Hawaii, primarily for the Honolulu Weekly. I was the first journalist to cover the issue in any depth in Hawaii, and the first to write about it for a mainstream Hawaii publication — Honolulu Magazine. I wrote about biopharmaceuticals cultivated in Hawaii, minimal state oversight, federal dominance, the appointment of industry officials to federal agencies, the state's efforts to attract biotech, the industry's support for UH research.

My reporting earned me the ire of the chem companies, most notably Pioneer's Cindy Goldstein, who tried to publicly discredit me, rallying some UH biotech researchers to her cause. My work, which I thought was important for the public's right to know, cost me assignments with Hawaii publications that didn't want to risk alienating advertisers because I was too hot to handle. The general public, meanwhile, didn't seem much interested.

During the seven years of writing this blog, I've continued my research, writing extensively about pesticides and genetic engineering, the cozy relationship between regulators and all industry, the problems associated with using antibiotics on livestock, stressors on pollinators, etc., etc. I've covered countless local and international environmental issues, as well as the misdeeds of numerous “government actors,” most notably former Prosecutor Shaylene Iseri.

As recently as a year ago I was still castigating the seed/chem companies, though by that time I had begun to realize that something is rotten in the state of Denmark. Or to paraphrase, I had come to understand that the anti-GMO movement in Hawaii — and pretty much all the environmental movements, too — was not a David fighting Goliath, not an underdog, not in any way pono.

My disenchantment began in early 2013, when the Vandana Shiva circus came to town, and I realized somebody was pumping a whole bunch of money into what had been a tepid, powerless movement. Simultaneously, but not coincidentally, Councilman Gary Hooser began drafting Bill 2491, ignoring those of us who cautioned against overreach and including GMOs.

Meanwhile, I was investigating and writing the Abuse Chronicles series, in which I catalogued the systemic failure of a Kauai County regulatory process involving vacation rentals. I saw clearly, as did the entire County Council and Administration, the problems that can arise when government is unwilling or unable to enforce the law.

So when I asked Gary about enforcement of his pesticide/GMO bill, and he replied that enforcement didn't matter, all that mattered was getting the bill passed, I knew that he and outside influences were using Kauai to wage a bigger battle, and that our community was going to suffer.

I began digging around with the help of an akamai friend. We soon saw how much of the environmental movement is funded by the same corporations they claim to be fighting. We saw the ugly totalitarian tactics embraced by people we thought were progressives. We saw reasonable folks embrace a wild disinformation campaign. We saw activists intentionally stir up fear with absolutely no basis in fact. We saw the movement swell with people who were either new to the island, or paid instigators, like Nomi Carmona and Jennifer Ruggles.

I saw the intense pain they were causing by the attacks they were leveling on longtime farmers and local people trying to work in ag, and how they were undermining all agriculture with their short-sighted stance. Sadly, I saw folks who I thought were good people either stand by and say nothing about the ugliness, or join in the fray.

After watching the mob action that resulted in the passage of a badly flawed bill, and the deceptive Council shenanigans that led to Mason Chock's appointment to override the mayor's veto, I realized I was covering what my journalism professors had termed a “man bites dog” story.

In other words, what began to interest me was not the usual bad deeds of corporations, but the bad deeds of the so-called “good guys” — the folks whose rhetoric speaks to love, peace, aloha and progressive tolerance, but whose actions reveal them to be rabid fanatics who will stop at nothing to promote their cause.

What's more, they were so deluded, or stupid, they didn't even know they were being funded by the heirs of big oil and manufacturing,  that they were engaged in seed gathering activities exactly of the sort that had resulted in the collection of the Seed Savers Exchange being sent to the vaults at Svalbard — a seed bank funded by Dow, Syngenta, Bill Gates and the Rockefeller Foundation, with treaties that allow that genetic material to be patented — that they were pushing a bill that gave the industry exactly what it wanted: a clear court ruling that solidified the state's pre-emption.

They didn't even see they were being played as fools by Gary and all the other political ideologues who don't give a shit about what's right, but are driven instead by ego, power and their allegiance to forces other than their constituents.

As my friend wrote in comments yesterday: "When the anti side achieves what the chem corp wants, we need to question."

I began to question all the premises I'd previously held, all the slack I'd previously cut activists because I believed them to be on the side of good. Because when the “good guys” are using the same tactics as the “bad guys,” they can no longer claim moral superiority. With the sympathetic blinders off, I began to see that many of the activists I'd been covering for years are narcissists who love conflict and drama, and have no desire to solve problems or reach resolutions. I came to realize that lawyers I'd previously admired, like Paul Achitoff of Earthjustice, lie and deceive just like their opponents, and have a financial incentive to keep the litigation going.

Along the way, I also began to change my views about biotech. It isn't all evil, all bad. Decent people with lofty aims are devoting their lives to this research, believing it can do good. It shouldn't be shut down because of the false beliefs of ignorant fanatics. I've come to suspect that GMO labeling initiatives aren't driven by the "right to know," but an attempt to instill fear in order to build market share for organic producers. And I've learned that organic farming isn't environmentally benign, and it has its corporate backers, too.

It's all very complicated, and it's all intertwined. What's more, we're all complicit. It's mad foolishness to be blaming the corporations for our woes when we're all buying their products, helping their bottom line. And there isn't one activist, one true believer, who can honestly claim he or she is pure. I'm sick and tired of watching phonies claim the moral high ground.

So don't be dinging me for not bashing the “bad guys” enough. Been there, done that. There's a reason why I'm now banging on the “good guys." I'm hoping that some of you in that camp will open your eyes and see. But given the response to yesterday's post, denial and self-righteous is still rampant.

This is where I'm at these days, with a nod to Dave Mason: There ain't no good guys, there ain't no bad guys; there ain't no us, there ain't no them. There are only different belief systems, some rigid, some fluid. Some people cling doggedly to their beliefs, while others — including several in the Kauai political arena — exploit them for nefarious purposes.

But that doesn't change this one absolute truth: We're all in this together. And the sooner we realize that, and step away from our respective camps, the sooner we'll start working to create a better world. Until then it's just war driven by the false belief of separation.

40 comments:

Anonymous said...

And that's why politics sucks. Sound bites and half-truths advance the political careers of the morally bankrupt. The irony is that many vote for them thinking they have a strong sense of what's right and operate with integrity. Gary is probably one of the worst on Kauai. Mel is another one to watch out for. He's got the voting public fooled into thinking he's such a different man from his KPD Blue days. When the end justifies the means, be very concerned. And, the end for the likes of Gary and Mel is continued power in office. Gary will run for something different in 2016. Mel will reconsider a run for mayor in 2018. He's likely hoping for the chair position to advance that aspiration.

Joan Conrow said...

I agree with much of what you say, but please do not confuse KPD Blue with reality. That book was chock full of misinformation, speculation, exaggeration, sensationalism and outright lies.

Anonymous said...

Uncovering, deciphering, and speaking the sometimes unpopular truth, without ego or excess, is why we respect and love you. Thank you.

Anonymous said...

KPB Blue was a look inside the Kauai police department . Not 100 percent true ? So what ? What is wrtten that is ? A ton of insight was exposed . Credit where credit is do. Take it forwhat it is.... He did get the shit beatin' out of him . Mel is a pig and the police are crooked . Different subject.... What ever happened to your beautiful format where you stated each blog post with your description of the world in coloful and romantic thoughts? I always thought that they where your strongest writings . Please do not loose your strenghts in the political cesspool of life .

Joan Conrow said...

KPD was more like 1% true.

How can you gain a "ton of insight" from false information?

But otherwise, thanks for your comment re: my "description of the world in coloful and romantic thoughts." I stopped them when I started getting attacked, and didn't want to share my private world with the nasties. But perhaps I'll consider resuming those introductions.

Anonymous said...

As a Kanaka Maoli I align with two things...ka'aina me na kupuna. My actions are dictated by what is pono for ka honua and my ancestral kuleana as well as kuleana to my mo'opuna to come. Anything else is temporary and insignificant. My values remain consistent and existed before redshirt/blueshirt division and will be here long after this issue has petered out. I don't support candidates unless they are willing to address the elephant in the room of illegal occupation of Hawaii nei. Until such time all political maneuvering is moot.

Anonymous said...

Joan ? Please 1 percent ? GMAB !!!! I lived very near the head of narcotics ( no name) ( i anin't that naive ) in the past ..... The book is more true than false . It took guts to write it..... I am surprised that you do not give it more respect....on guts alone .

Joan Conrow said...

I am surprised that you do not give it more respect....on guts alone.

Perhaps it's because I had the misfortune of knowing the author, and finding him to be a gutless bully who harassed women.

Anonymous said...

Please understand that Ed Coll and many others have adapted a mostly recent tactic of referring to Westside Biotech Agriculture as "The Chemical Companies." This trick, if they get you to repeat it in your response, frames the argument in their favor. It is the duty of the opposition, or the impartial, not to be manipulated by this communication tactic!
Pete Antonson

Anonymous said...

As someone who orders pesticides for work I see the names (Dow, Bayer, etc) on the labels of many pesticides. So what are they now? Making money on both sides of their ass that's what.

Anonymous said...

...or you could just print facts...... I know, boring right?... or is it you don't feel people are intelligent enough to process them?

Anonymous said...

@1:27 Almost everyday I se the BASF commercial on prime time tv calling themselves "The Chemical Company" I think they are just getting their point across :)They have been marketing that way for decades.

Anonymous said...

Here is a way to determine whether they are in fact chemical companies or seed companies - do they have more patents on seeds or chemicals? Can they grow their seeds without the chemicals?

Anonymous said...

Joan, thank you for Kauai Eclectic. You do not have to explain yourself. Today's blog is a thing of beauty.
I will say this about that. You have been blasted by both sides of the political spectrum.
Your interesting and informative blogs have turned into a powerful tool.
Over the years there have been many GI contributors, the Kauai Times paper and many other social/news protagonists that have hit the island. And, it seems that only Georgia Mossman's snippets in her Police Blotter and KE have hit a home run.
I thank you for what you do, but again, I do not know why you post any APOLOGIA, I would say to your critics - F*ck You, it is my ball and it is my game.
Truth is a hard pill. And the truth is, this election is a bigee.

Anonymous said...

Ahh, yes, the truth lies somewhere in between.


The epitome of the human realm is to be stuck in a huge traffic jam
of discursive thought.

Anonymous said...

As my father often said..."the problem with politics, is politicians".

Anonymous said...

Your blog often makes me re-think my positions, beliefs, and opinions - looking to see why I have those positions, beliefs, and opinions...so, you go girl! We can agree to disagree on some things, and we can celebrate differing opinions and being open to learning new things which frame our opinions!
For what it's worth, I, too, miss your lovely, lyrical picture-painting introductions!
Pat Hunter-Williams
P/S did you get my email about a possible story/investigation?

Joan Conrow said...

thanks 10:48, 3:03 and Pat!! And yes I did get your email and will follow up.

Anonymous said...

Joan

One morning not long ago, pre 2491, just when the the fire was getting started, I too approached Gary while sitting in the airport waiting for next flight. I was thinking about approaching this bill and getting the players all on the same page for the 2014 election, this way we would have a solid base and veto proof bill.

Well I was shocked when Gary told me it didn't matter, it was about just passing the bill on the table.

I have not looked at Gary the same way I used to too

I have chosen to stay out of the limelight on this issue as my family is much more important to me than having the anti make life for them a living hell.

Your not the only one who tried to calm the seas before the egos just exploded

Anonymous said...

@ 10:42 am

With all due respect, your post makes you sound like a jealous individual. Mel's support is coming from the public, Which is a huge difference from being a self serving individual.

Joan I have enjoyed your today's post and consider it one of your best.

have a great day

Anonymous said...

there's a herd of elephants in the room: illegal occupation and the displacement of Hawaiians, global warming, environmental degradation, income inequality and all that follows from the concentration of wealth in relatively few hands, religious extremism and its excessive influence on political decisions, etc..

Anonymous said...

@2:32,
BADF, also known as the German company "Badische Anilin-und Soda-Fabrik" has absolutely nothing to do with Kauai's Westside Biotechnology Companies or the petty disrespect and cheap communication tactic of calling them something other than what they call themselves! It's just another example of the vile, supercilious, dishonesty of misdirection, and "the end justifies the means" attitude that Joan is writing about today!
Pete Antonson

Anonymous said...

joan, bee honest!

Joan Conrow said...

10:39:aka Jimmy Trujillo. I have been and am, though you wouldn't know anything about honesty yourself. Unless you meant I should've included how you repeatedly urged me to remain quiet about the red shirt BS I saw, since we were "all on the same side," set me up at the pollinator panel by bringing in a videographer after we'd agreed to no taping, which was my first experience with how the red shirts would stab even a friend in the back if it suits their objectives, and then repeatedly attacked and bullied me on FB when I started revealing the BS.

Anonymous said...

Joan re: October 22, 2014 at 10:39 PM
No explanations. Even in the spiritually free rainbow and unicorn land of of beeeutiful organics....there is a superstructure of ego and who did the most to further the cause.
Joan Conrow has done more to make awareness and change than any one, on Kauai for environmental issues.
SHe has done this by the power of KE, the politicos listen and the new found anti-joans know that she has the power....oh, how irritating is that? After the GMO thing is buried in the next election and Joan's new platform is exposed, then all the red shirts will be clamoring back to Joan's feet, thanking her for her new interest,

Anonymous said...

@1:27PM, Don't call the largest chemical companies in the world chemical companies? Why on earth not? Just to shift the focus to a more benign word like "seed". These companies make their money selling chemical poisons and that is the main issue right now- the poisoning of the land, water and air with chemicals.

Anonymous said...

Joan, Could you please tell us the difference between "attack" and "criticize". It appears that you often interpret criticism as attack. The word "attack" adds flames to the words- do we really need more flames in a world that is burning? And the words "redshirt" and "fistee"- cannot better words be found that do not stereotype everyone. Words are so important, especially how they are used. Do we wish to agitate, divide and inflame or to bring light to a topic through non-violent communication?

Anonymous said...

i don't buy the "without ego" parts that one commented on or we're all complicit for the sake of attributing why and what you speak about. levels of personal ethics and morals are deceptive when showcased to prove ones point(s), its grand standing. Good for you that you are so passionate and find the time to be the voice of a singular side of the intertwined flock. I do love reading your banters.I can't tag you a phony as its your right to chime away.
There is so much more that is known by so many others who circle around you. not about being complacent...tons of wrongs needing to be righted.

Anonymous said...

@7:26
I'm not telling YOU to stop using such words for your ignorant, unscientific, hypocritical, little propaganda efforts, I'm appealing to the majority to not help you frame the argument by repeating those words in their replies!
Pete Antonson

Anonymous said...

Pete Antonson, The person you are responding to is anonymous. Why do you call them "ignorant, unscientific, hypocritical"? What exactly did they say that is ignorant, unscientific and hypocritical. It is best to use facts instead of suppositions, don't you agree. Please show us the facts from their statement that supports what you say about that person. Mahalo.

Edward Coll said...

1:27 PM
Antonson said - “Please understand that Ed Coll and many others have adapted a mostly recent tactic of referring to Westside Biotech Agriculture as "The Chemical Companies."

THE TRICK
Antonson’s trick is his false statement wrapped inside an association fallacy.

THE FALLACY
Others (Antonson asserts) have referred to “Westside Biotech Agriculture as ‘The Chemical Companies’ “.
Ed Coll (Antonson asserts) has referred to “Westside Biotech Agriculture as ‘The Chemical Companies.’ “
Ed Coll is one of the “others” is the false conclusion.

THE FALSEHOOD
In addition, the association fallacy is itself based on a falsehood. That makes it a toofer, a double fallacy because Ed Coll (this writer) never referred to “Westside biotech agriculture as ‘the chemical companies’ ” as Mr. Antonson asserts.

WHO ARE YOU?
Antonson said - “This trick, if they get you to repeat it in your response, frames the argument in their favor. It is the duty of the opposition, or the impartial, not to be manipulated by this communication tactic!”

Who are you Mr. Antonson, the “opposition”, the “impartial” or perhaps the “other”? Has your trickery manipulated me into referring to “Westside Biotech Agriculture as ‘The Chemical Companies’ ” 5 times in this comment alone, although I have never before referred to the “Westside Biotech Agriculture as ‘The Chemical Companies’ ”? WAIT! That makes 6 times! OMG it worked!

Hmmmm….Are you Mr. Atonson the “other”? I ask because it appears you have manipulated me into multiple repetitions of your phrase to frame the argument in your favor, or should I say in favor of the “other”. One suggestion. The phrase doesn’t roll off the tongue nicely and is hard to remember. How about “Kaua`i Family Seed Farmers. Yes! That’s it! Easy to remember, rolls off the tongue and it sounds chock full of aloha to boot.

Anonymous said...

Ed Coll- A rose is a rose.....
Most people do not even want to discuss this Westside Ag/Chem Seed issue, for the reason you have so painfully exemplified. People get all bus' up for saying anything regarding Big Ag.
Sheesh, everyone knows what is meant, whether by euphemism or truism.
Fact is, Big Land is open for slaughter. Whatever they grow today or will grow tomorrow, Big Land will always be under attack. There is NO BIG Ag clean enough for the fistees.
BTW, Big Ag on this island isn't one of the cute l'il farms on the NS.
It costs a fortune just to keep the land fallow. Taxes, fencing, hana wai ditches, security etc. they all are expensive.
There were people against Sugar and if Sugar was here now, the same people would be complaining.
Sugar used over a hundred tons of dry fertilizer a week and hundreds of thousands of gallons of liquid fertilizer per week. The largest barge in the world (the Hawaii) was made specifically to transport the chemicals. In addition to the millions of tons of fertilizer per year, thousands of gallons of Paraquat and Roundup, Lorsban etc were used.
Big Ag must use plenny chemicals, that is how it's done. Even a million pounds of Chicken Shit don't smell no good. Let alone the flies li' dat.
The difference is the group of anti-anything-big has gotten larger. The island has had an influx of these antis. Many don't need no job, don't got no roots on the island and have inflamed the No Mo' GMO fad on Kauai. They all have the "I got here yesterday, so you can't come here tomorrow" elitism.
The anti-Ag group may well find themselves lubricating the door for Big Ag subdivisions, and these they will abhor.
The island needs good relationships with Big Land, they control purty much all beach access, water etc on the South and West sides. They may take umbrage at the hostile treatment they receive from you, Hooser, Bynum and the other flying fistess.
A good start to get back to reality and even keeled Conversation would be to get rid of da Hoos, Bynum and Chock.

GF and G&R are not the evil. Vendettas always fail.

Anonymous said...

Ed Coll is convicting me of a falsehood while acquitting himself on the technicality that he wrote "Chem/Seed Company" rather than the generalized "Chemical Company" attribution I gave to him and others in making my point. Can we get more disingenuous than that? My point was about sneaking in the word "chemical" to frame the argument (a fairly recent, but, mushrooming tactic).

After all, you're more likely to hear about "framing" in George Lakoff's Cognitive Science class at Cal Berkeley than in Ed Coll's community college class. It's a little advanced, even for my fellow Speech Pathologists!

Let me com college it down for you: when Nixon said: "I am not a crook!" he famously, and unintentionally, framed himself as a crook! If I were to say to you: "Don't think of Ed Coll as a Big Weenie!" where does the gentle reader's mind immediately go? When you deny something by using the cleverly chosen language of your accuser, you are doing 40% of their work for them!

So, I say again, if you oppose (like me) the vile, supercilious, dishonest, "the end justifies the means," Northshore Cult of Fear's lynch mob and their campaign of propaganda, or if you are impartial, don't use their argument framing language!
Pete Antonson

Edward Coll said...

Antonson said,...
“Ed Coll is convicting me of a falsehood while acquitting himself on the technicality that he wrote "Chem/Seed Company" rather than the generalized "Chemical Company" attribution I gave to him and others in making my point. Can we get more disingenuous than that?”

REPLY - Apparently so by intentionally misquoting me to make a point and intengtionally associating your misquote with “Westside Biotech Agriculture” which I never even mentioned.” A fact is not a technicality. You intentionally misquoted me to make a point and said so yourself.

Antonson said,
“After all, you're more likely to hear about "framing" in George Lakoff's Cognitive Science class at Cal Berkeley than in Ed Coll's community college class. It's a little advanced, even for my fellow Speech Pathologists!”

REPLY - I taught computer science not cognitive science. I agree with Chomsky’s assessment of Lakoff when he said Lakoff has "virtually no comprehension of the work he is discussing" and regarding Frameing I prefer Irving Goffman’s opus “Frame Analysis: An Essay on the Organization of Experience” whom unlike Lakoff does comprehend what he was talking about.

Antonson said,...“Let me com college it down for you: when Nixon said: "I am not a crook!" he famously, and unintentionally, framed himself as a crook! If I were to say to you: "Don't think of Ed Coll as a Big Weenie!" where does the gentle reader's mind immediately go?”

REPLY - To Character assisnation and disparaging a community college? If I said Mr. Antonson admits intentionally misquoted a writer and then associates his misquote with something a writer never said to make his own point where does the readers mind immediately go?

Anonymous said...

It's hard to tell from the unclearly written; but, Ed Coll's claim of being misquoted is easily checked by referring to the post above where his writing of "chem/seed" is in
italics. If that is a misquote, then
the problem is with Joan's post and
the objection should say so.
The subpoint here is that Ed Coll, despite attempts to disguise his
partisanship, was and is a supporter of 2491. His next reply can be an
opportunity to clearly deny that or to
address the vileness on Kauai Joan
so accurately articulated with
something other than a "Look Ma,
everyone is doing it" litany of misdeeds not taking place on Kauai!
Pete Antonson

Edward Coll said...

ANTONSON 1:15 PM- “It's hard to tell from the unclearly written; but, Ed Coll's claim of being misquoted is easily checked by referring to the post above where his writing of "chem/seed" is in italics. If that is a misquote, then the problem is with Joan's post and the objection should say so.
COLL - It is easily checked but you must look in the right place. Here is where Mr. Antonson mis-quoted me;

ANTONSON “1:27 PM Antonson said - “Please understand that Ed Coll and many others have adapted a mostly recent tactic of referring to Westside Biotech Agriculture as "The Chemical Companies."

COLL - and here is what I wrote and Joan reposted

COLL - “You say you have no soft soft spot for the chem/seed companies yet the bulk of your criticism is aimed at the anti-movement.”

COLL - And here is where Mr. Antonson admits that he intentionally mis-quoted me to make his point -

ANTONSON 10:48 PM - “Ed Coll is convicting me of a falsehood while acquitting himself on the technicality that he wrote "Chem/Seed Company" rather than the generalized "Chemical Company" attribution I gave to him and others in making my point.”

COLL - In addition you then associate your mis-quote with “Westside Biotech Agriculture” out of whole cloth. Is that clear enough for you Mr. Antonson? Finally Mr. Antonson leaves us with this totally bogus accusation without a scintilla of evidence-

ANTONSON 1:15PM - The subpoint here is that Ed Coll, despite attempts to disguise his partisanship, was and is a supporter of 2491.

COLL - As you have admitted in your own words (10:48) you intentionally mis-quoted me to make your point. Why should anyone believe your unsubstantiated claim now? Ask anyone (red shirt, blue shirt, politicians, look at my past posts on Kauai Eclectic and you will find I opposed this flawed bill. I am in complete agreement with Joan’s analysis and the court’s decision. I suppose in your Alice in Wonderland world of “Still beating your wife?” pop-communication theory opposition means support, and no means yes.
I think Leonard Cohen expresses my feelings on the bill and this dialogue;

Your servant here, he has been told
To say it clear, to say it cold
It's over, it ain't going
Any further

FIN

Anonymous said...

Very good Ed Coll! Glad we could smoke you out on your opposition to 2491 and all the vile lynch mob activities associated with it.
Now, we expect you to act like it instead of giving bullshit objections to Joan's spot on descriptions of the lynch mob, or trying to hide your position in the bullshit language of some academic neutral poser in post after post, or using the language the 2491 lynch mob prefers (eg "chem, chemical, drench, poison, etc.").
Oh yeah, we look forward to the "Real Ed Coll" rather than the one building deniability for his lynch mob friends!
Pete Antonson

Ed Coll said...

My position on the bill has always been clear. I never used the language you accuse me of. What has been smoked out is you Mr. Antonson and your willingness to engage in distorting other peoples positions to make your points. Good day Sir!

Anonymous said...

A year ago, on his facebook page, Ed Coll posts Andrea Brower's picture and antiGMO Huffington post along with the comment that
Andrea is an articulate
environmentalist. This is how Ed
Coll can have it both ways with his
progressive buddies. He posts an effective propaganda piece with the neutral comment for deniability.
He doesn't like it when I poke a stick into his cage of duplicity; but, that just makes it all the more enjoyable!
Pete Antonson

Anonymous said...

Joan - I marvel at your ability to cut to the quick and hoist the blowhards on their own petards. Why aren't you writing for the NYT? You are that good!